An orthodox explanation of New Birth?

[Geoff]

The New Birth
By Evangelist Paul J. Levin


John Wesley was asked why he preached so often on, "Ye must be born again." He answered, "Because ye must be born again." Have YOU been born again? Without it, you have no hope of escaping the terrors of hell or enjoying the glories of heaven. The Lord Jesus said, "Ye must be born again," (John 3:7).


I. WHAT THE NEW BIRTH IS NOT

1. It is not religion. Nicodemus was a Pharisee, a very strict religionist. He celebrated the Passover, paid tithes, said prayers, brought sacrifices and tried to keep the Law. To HIM the Lord Jesus said, "Ye must be born again." Lawkeeping, joining church, being baptized or living up to a religious creed will not save you. There will be many in hell who did all of these things. Will you? Ye MUST be born again.

2. It is not morality. You may try to keep the golden rule, pay your bills, be a good neighbor, keep out of jail, and live a clean moral life, but that won't save you. It is not recorded that our Lord said, "Ye must be born again," to cowardly, vacillating Pilate, or to two-faced, hypocritical Judas. Why? Because you would say, "I know miserable hypocrites like Judas, and men like Pilate need to be born again, but I'm not like them. I wouldn't betray Christ with a kiss after professing to be His friend. I wouldn't order Jesus to be beaten and then turn Him over to a howling blood-thirsty mob to be crucified. Gangsters, thugs, adulterers, whoremongers, liars, drunkards and gamblers need to be born again, but not I. I'm all right." My friend, do you realize that God's Son spoke these words on the new birth to a man who was doing his best to gain heaven? Without a doubt, he was neither a crook, drunkard, nor gambler. He was a true husband, a good neighbor, a man of clean morals, and religious. If he needed to be born again, so do you. How do you expect to make it to heaven without being born again if Nicodemus couldn't?

3. It is not reformation. Even if you would quit all your meanness, that would not be the new birth. Your trouble is not on the outside, but on the inside. You don't need exterior decoration, but interior regeneration. Satan wants you to rest in a false peace. We warn you in Jesus' name, don't be satisfied unless you have been born again.

II. WHAT THE NEW BIRTH IS

1. It is a mystery you cannot explain, but a reality no man can explain away. "The wind bloweth where it listeth (pleaseth), and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is everyone that is born of the Spirit," (John 3:8). Just as Nicodemus could not understand or explain the wind, so no man can understand or explain the new birth.

But the wind is a reality no man can explain away. Only a fool would say, "I don't believe in the wind because I have never seen it and I can't understand it."

See the wind move the big limbs of an oak. Watch the wind tear a house to splinters. You cannot deny the reality of wind! You cannot see the Holy Spirit. You cannot explain Him. But see His mighty power make the harlot pure, the liar honest, the drunkard sober, the blasphemer pray, and then try to deny the reality of it.

2. It is the work of God by which a poor, lost, guilty, hell- deserving sinner who receives the Lord Jesus receives a new nature, becomes a child of God and begins a new life. It is a second birth, a spiritual birth.

Physical life begins by birth. Spiritual life begins the same way-not by joining church and becoming religious. You cannot JOIN the family of God, you must be BORN into it. Someone has said, "You can't make a Christian out of anybody." True, Christians are not made, they are born.

A birth is the coming into being of a new life which has the nature of its parents. When you were born the first time, you were made a partaker of the old nature, the sinful nature we all received from Adam. When you are born again, you become a partaker of the divine nature (II Peter 1:4). Is this true of you? DO YOU have the divine nature?

No matter what kind of a religious profession you have made, no matter how good a person you may be morally, unless you have been made the partaker of the divine nature, you are not saved. God gives you this new nature the moment you receive His Son. It is instantaneous. You can no more be born again by degrees than you can shoot a firecracker by degrees.

When you are born again, you begin living a new life. That is what happened when you were born the first time; you began living a life you had never lived before.

Some think they are going to heaven just because they went forward in a meeting. Be sure you are born again. There may be a more spectacular change in the life of one who is a drunken, railing blasphemer, but even in you who have not been down deep in sin, there is bound to be a change when you are born again. There will be a new attitude towards the Lord Jesus Christ, His Word, and His people.

Are you SURE you have been born again? You may not know the exact day or hour you trusted Christ, but you should be able to say, "I know NOW I am born again." If you are not certain about this most solemn matter, I beg of you to tell the Lord Jesus that you receive Him now. Then read John 3:36 and believe it. "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life."

III. WHY YOU MUST BE BORN AGAIN

1. Because the Lord Jesus Christ said so. That ought to settle it.

2. Because you have a sinful nature. The nature we all receive from Adam is fallen, corrupt and totally depraved. God says the heart of man is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things. With this old nature you could not enjoy yourself in heaven. If you can't find any pleasure in a prayer meeting now, how can you expect to enjoy heaven hereafter? Heaven is a holy place. When you are born again, God gives you a holy nature that you might enjoy yourself in heaven, a holy place.

3. Because you cannot save yourself. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast," (Eph. 2:8, 9). "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us," (Titus 3:5). Now don't skip lightly over these two quotations from God's Holy Word. Read them again and again until the truth grips you. You cannot save yourself-you MUST be born again.

IV. HOW TO BE BORN AGAIN

"He came unto His own, and His own received Him not. But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His Name: which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God," (John 1:11-13).

1. It is not of blood. You are not a Christian just because your parents may be. You do not inherit salvation from your parents. Even though your folks may be saved, if you have not been born again, you are lost.

2. Nor of the will of the flesh. It is not by your own efforts and will power. You will fail. So why not stop trying? Instead of trying, trust, receive, depend upon the One who died and rose again.

If I'd ask some of you if you were a child of God, you would say, "I don't know for sure, but I'm trying to be, in my poor, weak way." Now suppose you ask Johnny Jones if he is the son of Mr. and Mrs. Jones and he'd answer, "I'm not certain, but I'm trying to be, in my poor, weak way." How silly. He is not their son because he tries to be, but because he was born into their home. If you are a child of God, it is not because you are trying to be, but because you have been born into His family.

3. Nor of the will of man. It is not brought about by any of man's religious creeds, systems, or ceremonies. No man or organization can do anything to you that will make you a child of God. Join what you will, go through ceremony after ceremony, memorize creeds, and try to keep the rules and regulations of man-made systems, but it will not save you.

I heard a man testify, "I have been the president of the men's Bible class in our church for the past two years, but I didn't get saved until just two months ago." For twenty-two months the president of the men's Bible class, a member of the church, believing in God and the Bible, but lost, because he had never been born again.

4. But of God. The Lord Jesus said you must be born "of the SPIRIT." It is God's work, not yours. It is a miracle. Only God can perform it. If God has not done a work in your life, you are not born again. Your part is to believe God's record about you, that you are lost and in need of Christ, and receive Him as your Lord and personal Saviour. He died at Calvary, satisfying the righteousness and justice of God, that He might take your sins and punishment upon Himself. He arose! and is seated today as God's Man at the right hand of the Majesty on high (see Heb. 1:3), and He is offered to you as God's salvation. When you receive HIM, you will be saved, for Paul says we are "children of God by faith in Christ Jesus," (Gal.3:26).

You do not receive Christ by taking communion. You receive Christ by faith. Just tell Him that you receive Him as your personal Saviour.

A personal friend of mine, a preacher of the Gospel, told me that he was a Sunday School superintendent before he was saved. A lady told me she was a church member 38 years before she was saved.

Before it is eternally too late, I beg of you again for your sake, your family's sake, for Jesus' sake, do not trifle with this thing. Bow at the feet of the risen Lord and tell Him you receive Him now. "He that hath the SON hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life," (I John 5:12).

Just bow your head and say: Lord, I am a guilty, lost helpless sinner. I believe You suffered on the cross for my sins and died in my place to pay the penalty for my sins, and that You rose again. I call on You to forgive my sins and give me eternal life.

Now read Romans 10:13: "Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." Did you call upon Him? Then He says you are saved!

See John 6:47: "He that believeth on me hath everlasting life." Did you believe on Him-that is, did you receive Him and trust Him for salvation? Then He says you have eternal life!

[Geoff]

My dear brothers and sisters,

In this well developed argument, our dear orthodox brother in Christ finally stumbles when he pronounces new birth an INSTANTANEOUS event.

Ponder for a moment the fact that nothing in nature is born without a gestation period, and in the case of humans, a new born baby cannot fend for itself, as gestation is really not complete yet.

Why is it that folks think the receipt of an eternal divine soul is instantaneous, requiring nothing more than a commitment?

I guess part of the reason is that they do not find anything in the Bible to disabuse them of this notion. One would think that they would expect Jesus to have preached often on an issue which certainly this preacher recognises as of critical importance. And of course Jesus did often preach on this very subject, but today hardly anyone has interpreted the parables in this fashion.

Take the parable of the wise and foolish virgins. www.new-birth.net/ntr/revelation39.htm Another parable dealing with Divine Love, if only they could see it. A few days ago I surfed the web to see what folks read into this parable. It seems it is meant to be either the bride of Christ, or a parable about being ready at any moment. If only they knew that oil is a synonym for Divine Love. That this means all have access to Divine Love, but only those who actually light their Souls (lamps) and thus live in the Love, extending Love to everyone and everything, actually prepare themselves for the Celestial heaven.

Now of course, when the preparation is complete, then comes the actual new birth. But the prepartion typically may take more than a life time. This naturally would distress many orthodox folk. Imagine dieing unsaved? :) But we also know that those who are actually reborn of the spirit, know that they are eternal. Of course we haven't met any recently. :mad: What we who have tried very hard to receive and live the Dive Love know, is that it changes you. As you look back on your life, you know you are not the person of even a few years ago. I have not heard this point put forward by my orthodox brothers, sadly. But at least we know that as their souls cry out for God's love, He is filling their souls with Divine Love, even if they don't realise it. But assuming this is a one time event sadly might lead to complacency. And worst of all, when they do reach the spirit world, they will feel very let down.

Much love,
Geoff.

[Digitaria]

I Want To Tell You About Life And Death

I cant tell you why there are different religions and sects, but I will tell you that religions will come and go. There meanings long forgotten. When someone learned in religion dies, he will not go to the Celestial Heaven, he will enter the Spiritual realm. This place is for mankind, that do not believe in the one true GOD. Of the many religions, many will have more than one God. They will continue to worship as they did on Earth. They have prayer, and a City which resembles places of worship on Earth. They do not know the one true God. They may or may not find him, this depends largely on how they conducted themselves in life and Free Will, when incarnate.

I would like to tell you a story about a little girl, who had the courage and foresight, to seek God in her heart. One day she asked her parents, where does God come from? The Mother replied that she herself, did not know. So the mother set about, to ask the clergy. When the mother arrived at the church, she asked her question. Where does God come from, as my daughter and I wish to know. The priest replied that he to, did not know, and that he did not have the answer. So this went on, until one day, when the girl was bigger and brighter, she asked the question again. Where does God come from, and where can I find him? She asked the clergy, she asked her family, but none could tell her where she could find God, or where he came from. So the little girl, went away tired and dejected.

Then came the day, when a stranger was to pass, through her village. He met and spoke to the young girl. He asked her did she, have any questions she wished to ask God. She said, where are you, and where do you come from? The girl did not receive the answer she expected, and she was about to turn away and leave. When she heard a voice from inside her mind. The voice said, I am your Father, and am with you always. All you had to do, was to look inside to find me. I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. you are my daughter and I Love you. You have tried to find me, but you were looking in the wrong place. Go now and speak to me every day. I am here for you, all you had to do was look. Go now, little girl and speak of your Love for me often, and I shall reward you with Divine Love, and rebirth into the Kingdom of God. Go now my child, I Love you. You are my friend and I Love you.


One day whilst out walking, when I was a small child. I happened upon a small wooden box, when I opened the box, the contents glistened and were of the strangest material, I had ever seem. So I kept the box and took it home. Years later, a stranger called at my door, and he asked, had I the curious brown wooden box. I replied, yes I have, please tell me what the curious objects are inside? The stranger replied they are the tears of the saints, and their beautiful song. I opened the box and behold, I saw the glittering tears of the saints, and heard their beautiful song. It was then, I spoke to my Father, and from that moment, he has never left my side.

[Digitaria]

I want to tell you How Things Are For Those People That Believe In Doctrinal Religions

This subject is of interest to you and concerns all mankind. What a man believes when alive is an important factor, as to how he is received when he is discarnate. He is now spirit and soul, although the soul is rarely perceived by spirit and mortal alike, it still exists. The soul was given to mankind by God, and in his image. I would like to say that know matter what mankind believes, whilst still incarnate the fact still remains, he is both spirit and soul. There is only one God the Father the Creator of all things.

No matter what religion we claim to be part of, it is only of mans intellect that this was conceived. These beliefs in doctrinal worship, these beliefs that men adopted about God are wholly erroneous, and have been the cause of much conflict throughout the ages.
Mankind is ready for the Truth and their is a need to know. Doctrinal religions have served their purpose, in portraying the belief in God, which is distinctly different from faith in God. Belief in God comes from the intellect, of incarnate man. These are either things which have been learned or taught, and serve no proper importance in the salvation of the soul. Faith in God is not something which can be learned, it is rather perceived, and in this perception the soul feels the need for Love.
Mankind sets about to create for himself a perfect love, where all needs of his intellect are cared for. This pursuit of a perfect Love although seemingly fair, does not serve to bring the Love you crave into your soul. This perfect Love you have created for yourself, can never measure up to what your soul needs, Divine Love. Faith can be taught but only when there is sufficient soul understanding, and perception, which comes from within. Belief in God should not be taught as it is injurious to the spirit, both incarnate, discarnate. What has been learned which is in error, will have to be removed.

The condition of cleansing these untruths can be a difficult time, the belief in God which is learned through Doctrinal Religions, advocates that God the Creator is, omnipotent and wrathful God. It is not taught that God the Father is an individual Father, to each and everyone of us. As I said earlier, what a spirit believes determines how he is received in spirit. If learned of doctrinal religion he will be in error, as to his relationship with God and his soul purpose to return from whence he came. He may however be a good and moral person with much of the mortal and perfect love, which God the Father always intended we have. The condition of moral, mortal Love with little spiritual intellect contains only the love of man. These beliefs will not serve to bring the child, unto the Father.
In their good and moral pursuit of love and happiness they will become fit to enter into the spiritual realm, where the spirit will pursue his belief in religion, and worship as they did on Earth. God the Father allows this to happen, and this process is the Laws of Attraction, which dictates where spirits are fitted to live. During the time the spirit spends in the spiritual realm, he is allowed to grow and pursue activities. If not perfected whilst incarnate he is allowed to grow in perfect love, the love of mankind. Enjoying intellectual pursuits. Eventually the spirit will come to the understanding that something is missing. This understanding only happens when the soul asserts itself. It will then become open to suggestion from spirits, with a higher soul understanding, which are able to teach them the Truth the Light and the Way. You do not have to wait, until you come to spirit to discover this Truth for yourself. Seeking the Divine Love will help you with the natural and perfect Love in your daily lives.

So you can see why it is injurious, to learn of doctrinal religions as it retards the souls development. As to those individuals that are not learned in doctrinal religions, their reception into the spirit realm is not much different. The Laws of Attraction are still operable. These spirits however are more responsive to the Truth. They do not have the weight of doctrinal error to be removed, and cleansed. If the newly arrived spirit lived in accordance with Gods Will, and was generally a good and loving spirit. In possession of much of the natural love, then he too would be fitted to live in the spiritual realm. Each in accordance with their soul understanding, so you see agnostics, really dont get it any better or easier, than a spirit who has a belief in God. Their path is one of the same.

So to conclude I will say that although not perceived, by the non- believer, the agnostic and every other spirit that has a soul, that on passing into the spirit realm this fact will be apparent. Depending on what you believe in life determines where you are fitted to live, in either the spiritual or celestial. It is far better to remove what is erroneous whilst still incarnate, and keep for yourself the longing for soul understanding, and faith that one day you will be reunited unto God the Father.
You have done well to receive my message. I have covered what I needed to say, and am most pleased with your rapport this evening. I am your friend and brother, I Love you Lisa. Your friend forever, Jesus of Nazareth

[Matthew Cassidy]

Geof
thank you for this wonderful interpitation of the truth of the new birth .I love this new site format.

your brother in divine love
Matthew

[Amada Reza]

Dear Geoff,

I agree with your statement that we all must go through a gestation while our souls are in that lovely process of becoming transformed from the image into the substance of God's Soul. It is an intriguing thought that we are becoming a part of our Heavenly Creator's very Nature of Divine Love. The more Love we possess, the more we become "like" God, and the less we are like our mortal parents. For some of us, this is a very happy thought. :-)

Thank you for your thoughts on this important subject.

May God's Love keep you happy and well, dear brother,

Amy

[harry]

Thanks to all:

As a new reader of the Padgett messages, I have asked for the Divine Love. I have done this a number of times and am sensing a difference in my outlook. I noticed that these posts refer to an incremental growth through a gestation period. This has been my experience always. Throughout my lifetime I have experienced spiritual exhaltation and joy from time to time, and since the age of 7 have sought God's will and attempted to implement it. I spent from 1983 until a few months ago embracing the Urantia Book's presentation of being transformed by cooperation with a Thought Adjuster. This, however, is different from being born again as such. This is more of like the Bible's "Be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind." It deals with constantly bringing my thoughts in line with the will of God as I perceived it. It involves thinking my way into improvement. As I understand the New Birth, so far, it is different. I believe that I read somewhere in the Padgett Papers that one requests in prayer for the Divine Love to such a degree that there remains no room for anything else. This makes God the savior, not myself by what I permit. To be sure, my part is to desire it and request it, but the birth is an act of God's through his messenger, the Holy Spirit. As I receive the Divine Love incrementally, I notice that I have not experienced anything by way of physically felt phenomenon . However, I sense that I am on my way and trust our Father to not give me greater serving of anything just because in my gluttonous appetite I ask for it. I recently watched our 2 year old grandson ask for a full plate of stuff when he had yet to start eating. His daddy admonished him to first eat what he had before he would get any more. I feel that perhaps my Heavenly Father wisely has determined that with 4 volumes of the Padgett messages I have a pretty full plate for now. I envy those who can name a date and hour when it all happened. I sense a lifetime of slow incremental growth. Have I arrived? I only know that I have asked my Father for Bread , the Divine Love, and have every confidence that in a manner of his choosing it is being given to me in response to my receptivity to receive it. I am happier now and am busy writing articles as I grow. This week I posted an article about Becoming Servant Minded on my site which points out the need of first of all being born again and receiving the Divine Spirit. When that has been accomplished, one quite naturally is merely joining the Heavenly Father in His caring for his children, our brethren. Otherwise, its just another religious activity which even detracts from loving God with all our heart,soul, and mind.
I hope I am understanding all of this correctly, and would appreciate more experienced persons with the Divine Love bringing me up to speed if my perception is in any way erroneous.
I love you all and am grateful for this forum and the gracious acceptance I have received into this family.

harry

[Amada Reza]

Hello, dear brother Harry,

Incremental growth seems to me to be synonymous with “being in the here and now.” God’s Divine Love is infinite. This means that our spiritual progression is also infinite. Perhaps knowing when “it all happened” is a comfort to the mind, but “it” happens all the time. :-)

I also understand from reading the Padgett messages that the Divine Love changes our very nature, therefore taking the hard work out of complying with the higher Will of Love.

I am very happy to meet you. Thank you for sharing your lovely thoughts.

In God’s Love, I am your sister,

Amy

[doug]

Dear Harry,

Welcome to the board. I read a bit of the material at your web site, and got the impression that you've been working on your new birth for quite some time now. ;) I especially enjoyed your article about the "Luciferian rebellion" -- the thoughts you expressed had that crystal clear ring of truth that I generally associate with "channeled" messages. I often find it difficult to respond to teachings about "Lucifer," but your article succinctly described the absurdity of the entire premise of "Satan."

Indeed, the journey of the New Birth is never ending, and the understanding of this, as Geoff pointed out, was where Paul J. Levin really fell down in the article at the top of this page. Aside from that misunderstanding, though, the article expressed some important truths (it's funny how things get "lost" on this Web board -- I don't think I'd ever seen this thread...)

The New Birth does not come about through "works" -- meaning through efforts of self perfection on our part. Our personal efforts to "adjust" our thoughts, attitudes, and actions are worthwhile and necessary, to be sure, but these efforts, and their results,
are not what Jesus referred to as the New Birth. The New Birth is accomplished through the efforts of the Holy Spirit, just as Levin writes, and our only task is to ask and seek and "open the door" to receive God's Gift.

Amusingly, many Christians are so caught up in the idea that we do not receive Salvation through our own works that they take offense when I tell them that they must pray for the Divine Love. They (or should I say, their teachers) interpret prayer as some sort of "works," citing passages in the Bible proclaiming that salvation comes only through Grace and Faith. We can see that this misunderstanding about the definition of "works" can become a major stumbling point for many traditional Christians.

In Christ,
Doug

[ccwk]

Dear Harry,

I do not have a great experience with Divine Love but do enjoy sharing my thoughts. I do not see any error in your perceptions. I believe that we all grow at a different rate and will observe a disparate number of views at any one time. What is important is that we manifest our love and share our views, our truth, our feelings and insights with total freedom (if possible) and then be open to loving feedback.

I read and enjoyed the article you referred to on your site and found it to be very interesting. Your article also stimulated my thinking about service. And these are some thoughts that I came up with. I think that the word “servant” sometimes elicits disparaging nuances and provokes many other negative feelings. I try to see it for what it means to me. I find service to be a privilege. We all serve in one way or another. We are all serving at any given moment one person or another. We serve our children, our parents our brothers and sisters, our friends and our companions. Life is service. So why run away from it, avoid it, fear it and shun it? Service is our opportunity to give our love.

Service has many forms. We serve when we pray, we serve when we learn, we serve when we receive, we serve when we play and we can serve when we rest. I think that more important is the quality of the service. Is there love, kindness, patience, compassion, humility, cheerfulness, joy, gratefulness, purity, honesty, sincerity, etc? I am privileged to serve. I am privileged to love. This is how I grow and progress. Service should not be a sacrifice. It should be my expression of love. Service brings happiness, fulfillment and contentment. Isn’t life boring without service? Every challenge we face will require our service, every difficulty and every obstacle. Will we serve with love or will we serve with unwillingness. If you believe that you have sacrificed when you served, will this make you happy? Aren’t you then expecting something in return? Is that love? The joy is in giving. Give your service. We all serve. We are born to be of service, to express our love. Will you be happy serving? Loving service is what strong souls are made of. Service is love’s vehicle. Life is service.

We all have an ability to serve. No one service is greater than the other, in loving service. We serve according to our ability and our station in life. We are God’s children because we can love according to our ability. We are asked to serve no more and no less than our ability, but serve with love. Service is voluntary just like love is voluntary. You serve because you love and you will do so within your limits. If you serve, serve because you love and it is within your capability. When you grow in love, your opportunity to serve will grow. Love comes and then service follows. Service is seen as a sacrifice when love is lacking. Pray to be of service and love will give you the opportunity. Would you serve because you are asked to, or will you serve because you are moved by love? Give love and you serve. Seize the opportunity to serve when you are moved by love.

I know that this is in similar to your article but I wanted you to know that I read it and that you made me think about this topic.

Love,

[doug]

Speaking of explanations of the New Birth in Orthodox Christianity --

The other week we had the pleasure of talking with a member of the Eastern Orthodox Christian Church during our PalTalk meeting. He seemed interested in our teachings, and I recalled a friend once telling me that our beliefs are very similar to those of the Eastern Orthodox church. Indeed, as we talked there seemed to be no noticeable disagreement in our beliefs.

The story of the Eastern Orthodox church is a fascinating one. My friend explained that the EOC claims to be the truly "Orthodox" Christian Church -- tracing its beliefs back to the original apostles. Here is one of many EOC web sites:

http://www.orthodox.co.uk/EOC.htm

We tend to think of Christianity as being either Catholic or Protestant, not realizing that there is a whole other branch of Christianity which has quietly survived-- and sometimes even thrived...



This same friend years ago lent me a book about Father Seraphim of Sarov -- a saint in the Russian Orthodox Church -- which contains a moving description of the transforming power of God's Love. I did a search on "Father Sarov," and came up with a web page which quotes the exact passage that I was thinking of. If you were feeling that we are the only ones who really know about God's Love, you might find this most encouraging:

http://www.philthompson.net/pages/library/seraphim.html

[harry]

Dear Amy,Doug, and CCWK,

You have no idea how rewarding it is to get your feedback and help.

Amy, your quote explains what I feel is happening to me now:

I also understand from reading the Padgett messages that the Divine Love changes our very nature, therefore taking the hard work out of complying with the higher Will of Love.

CCWK, I'm glad you and I are on the same page about being a servant. Its actually the same thing as being a lover. We are cheerfully working hand in with our Father as He initiates acts of love and kindness. What fun this is for me to be able to discuss these things with people such as yourself who actually understand these things!

Doug, you have confirmed my understanding with this quote:

The New Birth is accomplished through the efforts of the Holy Spirit, just as Levin writes, and our only task is to ask and seek and "open the door" to receive God's Gift.

I see now that I am to concern myself with whatever Father places in my mind to do and not worry about it. I am growing at a speed of His choosing moreso than mine. Often truths cannot be fully grasped until they are experientially obtained. We sort of learn things on a need-to-know basis and I already have more than I have time to properly read. I will check out the links you provided. I found some statistics which got me buzy. They show the spread of religious beliefs around the world:


Christianity has 1.9 billion members and is 33% of the population of organized religion.

That's a lot of people! Insofar as I am from a Bible believing background, I concentrate on this bunch of folks. My article Jesus' Mission is specifically designed to point out, from Jesus' own words that his mission was to bear witness to the truth. The article is a tool which anyone can use when talking with Bible believers. In fact, all of my articles quote Jesus only and afterwards I discovered that they are in-synch with the Padgett Messages...eliminating dependency on belief in Jesus' name, vicarious atonement, etc.

You'll (a Southern expression) are helping me and thanks.

love,
harry

[Geoff]

Dear Harry,

I think your experience of Urantia Book is typical of the majority. The majority, from my personal experience, are intelllectuals, and thus love an intellectual and mind-based approach. It would also seem that you did not come across the Teaching Mission, also called Team or TML? Again, this small group is shunned by Urantia mainstream, because they are, and have been for the last 12 years receiving messages from Celestials. If you had met this group, you would have discovered that in the last 12 years, the Celestials have spent most of that time getting these folk to practise "stillness". And if you found out what "stillness" is, you would discover it is asking for Father's Divine Love.

Much love,
Geoff.

[harry]

Dear Geoff,

Alas, you are right. I do lean towards an intellectual and mind-based approach to understanding God. I assume that our minds were meant for such things, although admittedly, except we become as little children in our faith, we have missed the boat.
I am familiar with the Teaching Mission. At the UB World Forum, I was made an administrator and the Correcting Time and Teaching Mission came under attack. I organized the forum, and worked closely with the moderator. With his help we wrote a heading article giving a brief history of the origins of the movement and through all of this I became better informed. I am friendly to the movement, but not a participant except as a lurker and reader.
As you describe "stillness" as asking for the Father's Divine Love, this is an eye-opener for me. I will study the commonality of this to ascertain its accuracy. If you are correct, I will give a sigh of relief. I do not choose to give a recital of all of the objections raised to the Teaching Mission for that would prove to be adversarial, which is not my intent. However, one objection raised was that the Urantia Book, as such, never mentioned that such a movement was forthcoming and failed to give it a proper endorsement or introduction....which would have helped. Some resented that the movement came forth declaring that we were now in a Correcting Time which used the Urantia Book as the textbook, and the Teaching Mission as its ongoing deliverance of messages. That they were self-proclaimed was an annoyance to some and that they inadvertantly minimized the Urantia Book to a textbook produced for the movements sake was a further annoyance. These and other issues have caused mainstream Urantia students to somewhat shun the movement.
I notice with considerable interest that the influence of the Teaching Mission has permeated both UB forums and this forum as well. A major sector of this forum is devoted, to transcripts received by mediums. True enough, they can be encouraging but generally I find they add little to the knowledge contained in the Urantia Book or the Padgett papers. I do concern myself that persons can become inclined to follow these contemporary transcripts to the neglect of every properly reading, studying, and comprehending the primary revelations. We have only so many hours in a week and I have to guard against spending a disproportionate amount of time with forums while neglecting the study of primary texts. This is a world wide problem. Persons will spend a lifetime studying about the Bible, while never actually reading it intently from cover to cover.

love,
harry

[InkyWhip]

Doug,

Thanks much for the link, the sermon from Seraphim was very
interestingly aligned with our teachings through the Padgett
messages in many ways. Though it did still tend a bit towards the
usual juxtaposition of 'heaven vs. hell' and how one wants to be

ready to appear before the awful judgement of Christ

And apparently, since Christ's judgement isn't unerring, fair or
even poor, but awful, you really want to make sure you obtain as
much of the Spirit of God as possible just so there isn't any doubt.
;) :)

I want to say more, but have to go back to work.

Hi Harry, Welcome!

Inky

[George]

Dear Geoff and All,

Staying with Geoffs topic here.....
... it would seem that we can find similarities in just about every religion and we find the good in everything.

Nothing will come as close, simple & true as the simple explanation of what the New Birth is and what its not as put forth by Jesus himself http://www.thedivinetruth.com/HowaSoul.html
and here http://www.thedivinetruth.com/TheDLofthefather.html and in a few other places to be found in the Padgett messages only.

But its always interesting and entertaining if you wish to see the similarities.

With Love,



George

[doug]

George,

It is fun to find the similarities, and to realize that God's Love is indeed flooding the entire universe, available to all who soulfully seek it.

I must confess that I am especially encouraged when I hear about the Divine Love or the New Birth from John Wesley or Father Seraphim, simply because of the huge numbers of people who are associated with their religious movements. As Harry notes, 1.9 billion people -- well, that's almost as many people as McDonald's has served hamburgers. What I mean to say is... ;)

It is fun to compare the Divine Love teachings with the Urantia, Course in Miracles, and other recent spiritual teachings, but quite frankly, I find it more exciting to contemplate the many millions of Christians of various denominations who have been hearing and reading about the New Birth and the Love of the Father for perhaps their whole life -- and who may already have acquired large portions of this Love, perhaps without even realizing it.

As Jesus said, the harvest is many...

[George]

Absolutely.

good stuff.

Definitely Kewl

[Geoff]

Dear Harry,

The biggest issue for most followers of the UBook is that they are totally against mediumship of any kind, believing that the UBook itself was not received "that way". This attitude stems directly from the individuals who initially organised the material - Sadler himself. Infact sadly, some paragraphs in the Ubook show the influence of his hand. I understand what drove him to that position, but the legacy is the issue.

The objections to the Teaching Mission are all spurious. One is either fearless, and open, or one is not.

As to the matter of contemporary messages vs the original text, I might remind you that things change. the Bible is 2000 years old. Even since Padgett, much has changed. One simply cannot remain rooted in the past. On the other hand, our contemporary messages merely speak to those issues that we concern ourselves with, and make current, and modern, what came before. I find it extremely heartening that we can receive today, much the same stuff that Padgett received over 80 years ago. It means so much more, that this is a living evolving thing.

It is apparently much easier today to receive messages than in the 1920's and 1930's, so we can expect excellent transmissions. And finally of course, forums give us an opportunity to be humans, real humans, having genuine relationships with others. In the end, it is our relationships that have the value, not the amount of stuff you can cram into your mind.

Much love,
geoff.

[harry]

Thanks Geoff,

In light of your post, I will try to develop more of an open mind to contemporary channeled material. Understandably I am advised to be selective and not buy into everything written. Fortunately the persons who frequent this forum are motivated first of all by a genuine love for the truth and hope only to implement it.

regards,

harry

[InkyWhip]

Since I, once again, do not have much time to post, I just wanted
to say Thank You to Digitaria for posting that wonderful message!
:)

Inky